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Leveraging the Cybersecurity Lexicon

Kerry Guard • Wednesday, March 15, 2023 • 46 minutes to listen

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Stephanie May

Self-motivated, organized, pragmatic and interested in the power of AI's inclusion of individuals with special needs. Creative and amiable manager with technical writing in multi-tenant cloud security system migrations. Macros in Office suite, AWS, Azure, and GCP fundamentals. Strategist for developing effective marketing ideas to increase outreach whilst maintaining NIST compliant standards. An advocate for intersectionality in the workplace using tools that are not just "shiny and new" but efficient in fostering positive team morale and productivity. Sometimes the best tools are the existing diverse skills of the team - move that goal forward with my help! My experience collaborating or consulting goes beyond the listed companies detailed below; to name a few: GSA, Sempra Energy, AAA, Caterpillar Inc., Blue Bottle Coffee, Lidia Bastianich, The Workshop Residence (Dogpatch), TFK, and Lux Art Institute.


Hello, I'm Kerry Guard and Welcome to Tea Time with Tech Marketing Teaders.

Welcome back to the show. I I just did this recording minutes ago and I couldn't help myself and immediately recording the intro outro for this because I am going to move a bit a few things around and get this out next week as Stephanie Gosh, Stephanie, what a conversation I came to tell y'all.

I met Stephanie through LinkedIn, we I've been connecting with folks on cybersecurity as most of you know. And her name popped up, and we go ahead, and it's really amazing conversation. And we had a prep call that was supposed to be 20 minutes that that lasted for at least 45. And you'll see why when you listen to this episode, as we go down these amazing, some of the most fun tangents I've ever had on the show.

I so love the fluidity of this conversation.

So Stephanie May is a project manager, Creative Director and financial analyst she has the most eclectic, it's not even a eclectic, it's these three worlds that sort of come together and meld that's given her this interesting journey in terms of her career. And so she has grown up in a household of five languages. She ended up in San Francisco and landed a technical writer job that then allowed her to understand how very technical folks talk to how non technical folks need that information. And she's become this liaison of communication.

It's so fascinating to think about language this way, in that even today, even though we all speak English, especially in the technical world. It is not we're not speaking the same words. We're not understanding each other in the same way. Because we come from such different backgrounds of things that we love, she brings up engineers a lot through this conversation around the the technical aspects that they have for the different languages, different coding languages. It was such a like the perfect analogy for what we all face, I have an amazing aha moment towards the end that I hope you all stick around for that sort of blew my mind as she was talking and unravelling where language comes from, and how language has developed in the cybersecurity and technical world and what we need to do with it.

We end our conversation around how we need to do a better job of communicating to one another and communicating our product. And the instead of thinking about the problem versus solution, she gives us better language for it. And I can't wait for you to hear it. Which is why I'm moving mountains here, people, to get this in front of you faster, because it's so timely. And it's what we all need to hear right now in a way to combat FUD in a way to speak better to our audience in a way to connect better to our audience.

It's unlike any conversation I've had around content. I've had lots of conversations around content. And while everybody brings something different to the table, I haven't, they all seem to follow a similar vernacular around how we talk about content and how we need to use content in marketing. And I haven't had a conversation like this before. So everyone, Stephanie may buckle up, buckle up and lean in solid gotta say.


Kerry: Hi, Stephanie, thank you for joining how to tie with tech marketing leaders.

Stevie: Thank you so much for hosting me. Great.

Kerry: It is so great. And I'm so honoured because it's very early in the morning for you. And I appreciate that you got a cup of coffee, and you're ready to go. So before we jump in Stephanie, with the conversation we're gonna have to be very excited about tell us your story. What do you do and how did you get there?

Stevie: Yeah, so I'm a creative PM. I've worked in a lot of hospitality industries and creative avenues in technology and security. I would say I'm a lexical library gatekeeper. Especially in the security world in cybersecurity. You have the acronyms of acronyms of acronyms and I have a are so many sheets to back that up. But here in Southern California, I'm very lucky to be part of a massive array of products in the cybersecurity world having to do with either, you know, privileged access management in that world versus just data migration world and risk assessments. And there's so many different industries that are coming up. They're so exciting. So many people utilise the services and the language that's around, it can be kind of a, like a, I guess you could call it just a cyclone of acronyms that people can't figure out. And it's good to have a liaison, or someone who can kind of translate to this, this language to other industries that are not as familiar.

Kerry: Take it all the notes, because it's said so many important things in there. Oh, thank you.

Stevie: Interesting. Oh, great. Great. Let's come back to it.

Kerry: Come back to it. Because I do want to, I do want to know, before we get into the crux of our conversation, which this all was all surrounds, in terms of language and the cyclone of acronyms that you get to liaison, which I just stuffable said that it was magical. Before we get into that, and really pull that part was one challenge you're currently facing.

Stevie: Right now, being able to walk my dog. This is so silly. I'm a different dog, mom. And I just sometimes just don't have the time to walk my dog. And I really treasure that time with nature to not be in front of five different screens. And having to have a dog walker is actually not my first choice. So that's my challenge right now. About for yourself.

That's so pristine. You also have snowstorms. Not too long ago, we're in San Diego. So definitely, we were having hail get LA has been covered in snow. What is happening to us? I don't know.

Kerry: It's crazy. It's just crazy. But I Yes, I hope that you are able to get out on the weekend and at least get some puppy time in and get out in nature. I agree that it's tough to do, especially in this weather where it's very cold here right now. So I'm having the same challenge of my husband was like, we are going for a walk today, Sunday and have you might tell her look to each other. We're like, we are so bold. So we like bundled up and you got us outside and we were so grateful for it. But we were having a moment of like, I don't really want to go. Nature is wonderful. In terms of what you're doing these days of you're sort of in limbo, you're you're in the in between space, you have a couple clients, you're freelancing, what are you doing right now?

Stevie: Yeah, I'm lucky to be contracted with rivian. As they're expanding and growing to Europe. They also I didn't mention this earlier, when we were kind of, you know, doing our acquaintance pre meeting before the podcast, but they're also opening up in Syria, which I thought was super interesting. They have a production facility out there in Eastern Europe, which is kind of mind boggling to think that you know, we're really just the US and these evey cars, we're just really stretching out to all different areas. I mean, Germany is going to be one of the other big ones but Georgia in the US they have a big production facility and then they're doing these amazing, innovative countries convenient stores, because you know, it's the American dream to be rivian this adventuring cowgirl cowboy world. It's like that. It's so American. I feel like the Evie brand for rivian is just so spot on that's like mountains deserts we have it all, you know, and for them to just go to like Eastern Europe in the middle of like another dry desert to do more building. I think it's kind of cool, but they have these convenience stores that they're coming up with that'll have sustainable, you know, biodegradable water bottles and more healthy, you know, fair than the 711 You know, secret stuffed burrito that you have no idea what you're eating. If you're stuck in the middle of nowhere, you know and you need to charge your EV you also need a snack right? So a healthy snack would be preferable. But yeah, because their cars go you know, 350 to 400 miles without having to be recharged. I mean, you can do some adventuring, but eventually you're going to need to re recharge and so they're opening up new charging. See Asians along with the convenience store, they'll have more inspiring brands, which is super cool. Anyway, sorry, went on a tangent. You know how I dork out on rivian? I? So I yeah, I love it. So I did a short stint with them back in 2021 when they were doing their high volume production in Texas and in normal Illinois, and I was just doing compliance and more of the provisioning around their security systems. But you know, privileged access management is the huge topic in the US because we're so populated were we have for peace, you're bursting from the seams in every city with so many people. And that's like the number one question I get left and right from different business owners, whether it's huge corporate entities, or small business owners that are looking to vamp up their cybersecurity portfolio with different products. And they're looking at like, Well, how do we monitor and regulate who has access to what information because you don't want to store it all in one area and you don't want certain departments to you know, it gets convoluted you need you need those risk management, off operation tools in place before you do anything else. Right. So anyways, that's what that's what I'm working on right now.

Kerry: Got it? How about your your, like collided between the cybersecurity space and your love verbiage? It's like, the perfect storm? Yeah. Is that what you're looking to get back into with them? Are you work? Do you still want to stay in the cyberspace? Are you looking to branch out what sort of,

Stevie: you know, I'm such a people person and being in my little bubble. Being in my little bubble, like this is such a great opportunity to speak with you and have like conversations around cybersecurity and the marketing world around cybersecurity. Like I love marketing, and I love people. And that was the one thing that I was missing kind of being my head, you know, under my desk, and having all these screens around me and white. Like literally, we had whiteboards around our entire ceiling floor everywhere in the office, I was freaking out too, because we were constantly coming up with like the next best tools for different companies. And I was working with GSA, which was the General Services Administration for the government here. And there's a lot of changes happening a lot of uplift. And I had a proposal that went to the Senate. And I'm really proud of that, sorry. Just plug it in, fluff that up a little. Throw that in there. But there's some really great processes being put in place with monitoring. And yeah, I could go, I could go off on that. But I think the main point that I'm trying to make is that, obviously, in the government, we have acronyms, but even in the cybersecurity world, you have acronyms, and it's a whole different language. And you have to be really good with adopting language. And maybe that's why I grew up with four different languages in my household as a kid, so maybe that's why it's so easy for me to pick it up. I don't know that might actually just discovered this. My family spoke German in the household and Peruvian Spanish, which is mostly like there's some slang terms that are different from like, Mexican Spanish or Spain Spanish, but yeah, Spanish, German. I studied Japanese. And my mom spoke French. That five and English. Yeah, it's Yeah. So I was used to growing up with a bunch of different language in my household and I lived in Japan for a year. So that was a time where I actually really applied it. But yeah, so that's just me the LysM lexical library girl,

Kerry: how did you how did you get into it? I can see how you love you Love Language clearly, if you're willing to learn five of them. And I do know generally you know, when you're when you're younger, and you pick up one language, it gets easier to pick up several so I could see how it would multiply so quickly. How did you Where did you take it from there? Like you went on this journey to ended up in cybersecurity and working for companies like rivian in that space around compliance language? What was the fill the gap for us and how you got from a household of five languages to working in the cyberspace around using language as sort of the crux to it all?

Stevie: Yeah, that's a good question. The I'm by no means an expert in all those languages. I'm just kidding. I can like pass maybe, like a very agreeable five year old in some of those languages. But for the most part Spanish is pretty easy for me being close to Mexico actually just went to five to go to Lupe, to go drink wine, which was really nice. But that was for my birthday. And being able to practice them, you know, be in big city living where I lived in the Bay Area for six years. And it's like, you have a whole world living in a very short diameter city where you can like you can run across the whole city in less than a few hours if you really were, you know, a marathon Ultra runner. So being able to have access to so many different cultures and ethnicities in a very small space. You get to hear different languages all the time. It's me and my sister always argue about which is the better big city. Is it New York City, or is it San Francisco? Which one is it and they've both had their better years? I'm sure. New York City I'm sure is like the one that's that's really spearheading everything, it seems right now, it seems like so many companies are just focusing solely on New York City. But um, but the Bay Area has a special place in my heart. And so growing up in Southern California, my mom grew up in LA, I am not a big city person, even though I'm like saying, you know, I've been so involved with the cities, I grew up in the hospitality industry. My dad was a chef. So it's like the world comes to you when you make delicious food. So in itself, you get to learn about people and culture in that way. And but living in the Bay Area was a big jumping point out of my small little bubble. And plus, it was around the time of big social media tech boom, Silicon Valley was growing like crazy at the time, starting like 2005 to 2012 that I lived there. And it was a big time, Salesforce, you know, took over and so many amazing companies. I mean, Okta, I mean, the list goes on and on Asana, like all of them are incredible. And yeah, I guess that's why I'm working as a project manager in the cybersecurity space and dabble in marketing, because I just am so used to interacting with people. And that's my, you know, that's my big power up is being around others. So how about for you? How did you enter the cybersecurity space?

Kerry: For us, it was a back in Wani, it's about seven years ago, we ended up flying called extrahop, when they were just been that sort of phase. Now, we're actually going after keywords around for an SEO agency. So they're going after keywords around something called wire data, which wasn't a thing. And nobody was searching for it. And so we were able to say you're actually doing cybersecurity. So it's, it's starting to become a thing. And you're on the you're on the cusp of it. So that was sort of our break into it. And then we've just been picking up clients along the way. And it's, it's now where we want to focus because it's such an important industry. And it's such an honour to be part of the mission of what such great marketers are trying to accomplish and to feel that. So that's how we got into it. That's why we do it. And that's why I'm here talking to you, because you are part of that atmosphere of people who are trying to make a difference. In terms of language, being so important to you, from such an early age, how did you bring that into what you do today, or even did back in 2021? Before that, did you write content? Did you you said you were you were the liaison of these actors? You know, you sort of were the liaison of the technical to the non technical folks that booked through writing was that through interviews was that through what was the purpose? And what was the output?

Stevie: Yeah, um, you know, okay, I think the pivotal moment was when now we're getting kind of personal here, but I am a cancer survivor. And when I was diagnosed with cancer, I was like, Okay, I gotta make some big shifts in my life. And I decided to take a position as a technical writer from a marketing background in hospitality doing, you know, SEO integrations with email marketing, optimization. I did a lot of writing, but it's maybe because I love to talk. So maybe that might say something here. Um, so anyways, that just translated easier to go from email marketing to technical writing, I was already a sponge ready to learn it all. And I ended up planning a job don't even this is honestly, it's kind of embarrassing to say it was a fluke, but it kind of was a fluke they did. I do have a skill set that is unique to me in that I've had a lot of great experiences in the Bay Area working in SAS, and working even in like Blue Bottle coffee, which was people gather around coffee, no matter what industry you're in. So you just meet so many people that way. And I worked for the founders of Blue Bottle coffee. And then that, you know, I just pivoted in 2020, I actually fainted right before everything shut down here in the States and 2020. And I realised something was really wrong with my health. And I was like, I just have to work from home, like, I can't do everything. And I'm the type of person that wants to do everything. So I got this technical writer position, because they were looking for somebody with marketing background, they had 10 different clients that they were juggling and a very small team, it was only five people, but they were all from different backgrounds. There are some new engineers from Mexico City, there were some engineers from Germany, there is no people from everywhere in this office. And the leader was somebody who had grown up with with kind of a military background and was very well respected in the technical and security world. He worked for Tiger Inc, management, which was like a huge hedge fund. It's still a huge hedge fund, it's worth $56 billion and only has 100 employees. But they he was a very financial analyst, I learned so much from the financial side of things from this mentor of mine, but I think the reason they stuck me in there was because they were looking for somebody who could speak to a bunch of different industries and brands and could discuss these technical qualities in a way that was absorbable to different cultural backgrounds to different industries, period. So that's my secret power, right. And I was like, okay, I can do this. And even though I was super intimidated working with AAA Sempra Energy we had so many, even when like the pipeline got hacked over in on the East Coast, Sempra Energy was freaking out. And we were their go to person for consulting on how to secure their systems better. And it was just kind of mayhem over here. But yeah, it was a really great growth time for me. And I met a lot of really great engineers who I'm still friends with, that we all love language in different ways. And I learned a lot, too, because they were there even, you know, listen, in the coding language world, we have people who were like AR, some people are Python, some people are rest. And it's like, okay, how do we all get on the same page here? And it's not just about like, physical. I'm not just talking about communication language in like people to people, but I'm talking about machine to people to people. So you know, Rust is a really cool language I'm really interested to now and I'm not I'm not an engineer, by any means. I definitely cannot take that title. But I like to dork out here and there. So yeah, how often do you find a way that really works for you, when you're Mark marketing background? Like you have to speak to all these different industries and different types of people? And what if their language is, you know, Python? And they're like, oh, no, but I'm really good at this. And they're kind of stuck in their tunnel vision with what they're doing. How do you open their eyes to something else?

Kerry: So I'm married to an engineer. Oh, right. Yes. So So yes, to that. He gets very tunnel vision sometimes on his way. Which he feels is the right way. So it's trying to understand why he feels that's the right way and digging into the why that's the right way. And then, through questions. He sort of stumbled he sort of trips over the truth, his own truth of of seeing other opportunities. His first answer to almost everything as most engineers will test is no. You asked him a question. And there you go, can't be done. No, no, not happening can't be done. And then he goes away, give him space. Don't harp on it. Go, okay, okay, okay, give them some space. Go mull it over, it's usually a subconscious that does most of the modelling and it goes back and goes, alright. I think there might be a way. And then we talk through. So it's, you know, one, just understanding your audience to your point, right? Like, how do they think it or the intermediate node type of person. And if you, if you push them in the moment, they're going to double down on it pretty hard. So if you just go, okay. But then walk away, if it comes back to you later, that always helps for me. It's just giving, it's just being very curious about why they feel like their ways the right way, and not pushing your idea, but just asking the right questions to understand more about how they think.

Stevie: Yeah, why, why and how, right, like, why and how are always good words to kind of like poke the bear with? Yeah, and she's here.

Kerry: Sounds very complicated.

Stevie: Well, it's not that complex. Oh. But why isn't a complicated because it sounded complicated. It's not complicated. Here's why it's not complex. So see, yeah, to your point, it's, it's very much been pulling those barriers away, and not making them feel like you're trying to tell them how they're doing. Never trying to tell an engineer how to do their job. Oh, no, I you want to be curious instead of the questions and have them find a way, ultimately, for them to tell it that what are you trying? for them? It's like, what are you trying to accomplish? Stop trying to tell me how to do my job and tell me what you're trying to accomplish and doing my job. And I'll tell you the best way to get there. That's awesome. Another thing I found with engineers, too, is never say, Well, what about this? Or what about this? What about this is to say, here's what I'm trying to accomplish? What are your thoughts around that end goal? And sometimes it's not possible, and then they go away and think about come back. Say, Okay, I think I found a way. And other times, so if it's third trade, buy it, then the Lean end. And the big goal, I think that maybe if we did this, you know, depending on what the problem is, but if you if you present an engineer problem, versus a solution, you're always gonna have a better conversation, I find.

Kerry: Yes, absolutely. Like how I need help. How do I how do we help this this area? Most people are always wanting to help. And it's such a, it's such a compliment to someone to say like, I think you have the answer. Like, I think you are the good problem solver. Like how do we do this? I know, people want to help inherently. And that's I think, what brings a lot of teams together to it's true.

Stevie: engineers work or not definitely that, like they want to be helpful. That's definitely ingrained in them help. they're problem solvers. They want to be helpful. So if you approach it that way, yeah, that definitely brings folks together for sure. Yeah, let's talk about I love I love. I love our tensions are so good. I'm getting back on track around language, and you being this liaison. So it sounds like you were in meetings. And you were, you are sort of the go between the very technical, your very technical mentor and the other side who was like, I just need this date fixed, and him trying to get very technical information on how to fix the thing. And then you sort of being like, Okay, I'm going to distil down what you're saying and actually then go tell them how to do it in a way that isn't all this jargon. So you have Alexa, you have a lexicon a library of products. Was this just yeah, for your own personal? Like? Let me hang out

Stevie: this. Yeah, this was like in 2020, when otter dyo are, what is it?, I think is what it is. That was in beta, right. And so and like people didn't want to be recorded, you know, like, that's always you gotta ask permission and make sure you know, that people are okay with that. And transcription. You know, we have a very agile team that was influenced by the PMI, the Project Management Institute, standards of like, this is how the environment of the office should look like and this is how people are most engaged. And the biggest hurdle is this initial like task on phase where you're taking your siloing it's like a silo, or like how you said, distilled. Like, those are such powerful words when it comes to tonnes of information and pressure. Sometimes you have these time management issues where engineers go, Oh, God, I'm gonna get a lot of flack for this one. Engineer sometimes don't have the best time management skills. It's like, how can we, you know, they're makers. They're like people who are into this like tactile process of creating And the process is like, sometimes what really engages them. So throwing different, you know, a dictionary having like this resource centre to okay, this is what this client is focusing on. And these are the words they're using. These are the buzzwords that they're using for their marketing. And what how do we how do we celebrate that? How do we support it, and I have sheets, I have Excel sheets, Google Sheets, upon Google Sheets, from different acronyms from different companies, and everybody has their own powerup way to get their team moving. And they take pride in the time and effort that goes into like this language that they create for their team. And it's almost like a cult, let's be real. I mean, it's kind of like, okay, how can we hook people in? How can we get them invested in our white pages? Like, how do we get the white papers in through their head? So they're using the language they've adopted this new, you know, this new system? And how do we make them want to be a part of it. And it's really about just like, knowing what language works with what types of people and for me, I'm an empathic leader, I'm not going to be that project manager who inundates you with pings and emails and annoys the crap out of you. But I think what really hooks people in is you celebrate what they're doing and what they're doing great. And that's what like, empowers people to continue engaging, right. And so having the library just like, the first thing, everybody loves a library, I think it's like a sanctuary, you know, you go to a library to find peace and quiet and like, words are powerful. And so coders and engineers, they get that they're like, yeah, like, I love rust, I love Python, this is my thing. And if you show that you care about that, and you, you show respect that you know, some of the language and you can say like, yes, like, Thank you for, you know, finding a solution in this area with this tool. You can also, you know, allow them the opportunity to have a resource like this library of acronyms to look, look back to and reference over time, because most of the time you get lost in these projects of like, how do we come up with this creative solution for this client and give real MVP like this minimum viable product needs more value? How do we give him more value? Well, sometimes it's just iterations of iterations having to do with language. So I don't know that's so I just keep a library of sheets for different different companies, big big companies, small, small, you know, SAS and pas companies, all of them, I just have my little library. It's my personal place.

Kerry: I'm having an epiphany. And I'm either gonna sound really intelligent, and I'm gonna help other people have the epiphany or sound really silly for not having recognised this earlier. I don't know which way this is gonna go. So here it is. Let's see, I didn't realise because I'm not on the I'm not on the brand side, right. I'm an agency, and my clients show up to me. And they say, here's the messaging that we would run with, here's, like, they have that all figured out. Our clients have figured out what their messaging is gonna be, who their personas are, what their landing pages are saying how they need to speak to their audience, they have done all that work, I'm just showing up and perpetuating that message out into the world. Right? It never dawned on me that all these acronyms that are showing up in this space are actually coming from marketers like that. It's marketing language. And

Stevie: that's so great.

Kerry: Like, I just thought it was like an industry thing that sort of just happened. But when you create categories, and you create whatever this thing is that your product does, and then you shorten it, you have this acronym in this thing. So MDR XDR? You know, I'd love to know who created these first and then what other companies sort of latched on to it. But yeah, I didn't realise that it was a marketing team. We're all to blame for the first screw.

Stevie: The confusion, yeah. Like, what does that is that meatless viable? Produce? I don't know. If you, I mean, you can come back to like all these different iterations of what they mean and giving it new value, but also it's it's the government to like compliance standards, not just marketers. But marketers are huge proponent of what gets put into legislation too. I think marketers really need more. We need more, you know, a pat on the back here. We're really supporting a bigger system. Yeah. Yeah.

Kerry: I mean, they're, it's important to find the right words describe the right thing, right. So like when you initially said, what was it called? Privilege access? What was the full acronym privileged, privileged,

Stevie: privileged, privileged access management?

Kerry: Access Management? But then when you describe it, I was like, oh, no, I have heard of this. I just didn't know that. That's what it was called. So yeah, I think it's language is so important. And we all sort of, there's a lot of talk in the industry right now around using the right language and not using fear based language. So it's, I guess, I'm curious to know, like when this when this happens, and marketers create their own way of talking about things and describing things. And the acronym soup that we have, I love that you have a library for all of them. I think that's, I think we all should do that. I think that's incredibly helpful. I hope my team is listening to this right now. And being like, oh, we should just go look at all of our clients and all the acronyms they use and break those down. Like, yeah, we should go document them. Yes, yes, you should go do that.

Stevie: It's kind of fun. It's a really peaceful little garden of words. I highly recommend it. Yeah,

Kerry: that's yeah, and a great, a great resource to go back to, to your point. I think it's just really powerful. What would be your last piece of advice for marketers in this have? What's the balance between white cop with your own language, wanting to wanting to shape the industry, but also wanting to meet your audience where they are, and not? Because it feels like a barrier a little bit. Like, if we're constantly creating the language as marketers, then we're basically telling our audience that they have to come to us and that, so there seems to be a little bit of a bridge, we need to build there of meeting our audience where they are and how they're talking about it.

Stevie: Yeah, you know, I think having a genuine interest and where they want to grow, is always a good jumping point. And as you said, like, empowering your team with resources. Encouraging, like more learning. And r&d is so important. In any you know, like, that's, that would be my last two cents here is just like, do more research and develop, like there's, you will, you will exponentially grow your value when you're more informed. And even when it goes back to like NIST practices. Those fortify those acronyms like that is the trust factor. And that's the less fear based proponent is knowing what is expected of you and knowing, like law and order here, right, like Mrs. The National Institute of Technology. I actually forget what S stands for sorry, is somebody who who has laughter look at my library, hold on. But those standards are really important for any industry, right. But also just knowing, you know, knowing your client, knowing, knowing what their message is going forward their virtues, I think is always an important part of being in the marketing world. It goes back to that story, you know, like, what story are you going to tell? And why? Why are you that unique story? I think it's really weird how like pitch decks with new, newer, you know, startup companies, when they get seed funding, it's all about like, the problem and the solution, right? And I find that so bizarre. I'm sorry, no, I'm totally digressing.

Kerry: No, I think that's so important. I think, yes, this is where we're going to end and it's going to be glorious, because yes, all pitch decks I don't know that all pitch decks are proposition you'll know that better than me. But in the marketing world, when we're talking about SEO, and how products get found, it is very problem solution. So tell me more as to why you feel like that's a bizarre approach.

Stevie: I just think it's so negative, like why are we focusing on a problem when we can just be focusing on how expansive this can be for a large group of people? And that means But there's a solution for many different questions. And I'd like I like the perception, perception and answer. Perception and answers shows that we have point of view. And it's important, and it's going to be important to the mass, the masses. And the problem can be very specific and sometimes problems. They're just, it's not really, it's not a very striking word. I think problem makes you feel like grudge begrudgingly. I don't know. If you say problem solution. It's like, I don't even know if I really want to hear what the problem is. I have so much on my load already. Like, why do I want to hear a problem and a solution? I'd rather hear a perception and a solution. Or point of view and solution. So let's Yeah, anyway,

Kerry: that's just me. Yeah. No, I absolutely love it. I want to understand more around what perception means to perception word in this context.

Stevie: Right? Well, coming from a multi language background and multicultural background, you have so many different people from different parts of the world that are experiencing something that's unlike what you your individual message is, and knowing and having the r&d component to your marketing, knowing where they're coming from, is going to be the biggest solution. igniter let's just say that. So perception, and being able to put yourself in somebody else's shoes, leading with empathy, is going to allow the solution to come up, I think so much more accessible. So that's me, I just don't I don't jive with some of the original pitch deck lingo, you know.

Kerry: And I love this. I think we're all I know that everybody who's listening, but I'm inspired to change how we approach this, and how we think about it from our audience. I mean, we do a lot of Persona. Our strategy team loves to take into persona and understand our audience before we put together any sort of recommendations. And so I think this is, I hope they're listening, because this is so good to resonate with them. Stephanie, this has been amazing. Before we close out, I do have one quick people first question for you, which we've we've iterated on, given that today is International Women's Day. And so to close us out, Stephanie tells me, well, who was one woman in the business or cyber and or cybersecurity? Well, they don't necessarily have to be, but who's one woman that you really admire?

Stevie: Yeah, so Marianne Davidson, who is just spearheading the cybersecurity world, from the US side of things, has just received so much acknowledgement. She was the consultant to the 44th. President here in the US, she is the, you know, the Eisah, the information systems, security associations, Board of Directors, I mean, she's just a powerhouse. And there's been 65 years of women being in tech and making huge contributions, but to say that we actually have somebody who's leading the way, fearlessly, like being having to put your name out there as the cybersecurity consultant for the United States during a political time. It seems like so I don't want to tell choice or whatever. This woman I is totally fearless. I like cannot believe like, I would not be using my name. I would not want my face out in the world. And here she is just like leading everybody and doing such great work. Yeah, so I think I would talk about Marianne Davidson. She's, she's just an incredible woman starting, you know, her early years in the US Navy, and then now just doing so many cool new things as an Oracle. I think she's the CEO of Oracle. Don't quote me on that. But anyways, she's just

Kerry: incredible. Chief Security Officer. She's the security officer. Okay. Yeah, that's great. Okay, so Oliver on LinkedIn. Amazing. Yeah, definitely. This has been such an honour. Thank you so much for joining me.

Stevie: Thank you for having me. It was so nice to contribute and get to hear your perspective from your very established incredible marketing firm and your agency is doing good work too. And it's so inspiring to see you flourish and especially in on such an international level. That's just so cool. Thank you.


That was my conversation with Stephanie may now you know why I had to move mountains to make this all happen for y'all. I'm sure even one of the conversations we didn't get into that I wanted to, but we just didn't have time was around our chat GPT is impacting the way she uses language. And so I'm sure that you're all thinking about that now. And I would encourage you all to take that step back and say, How can I position what we do around perception versus problem? And how can I understand my audience from an empathetic standpoint, to be able to speak to them in their language and meet them where they are, versus trying to conflict come up with a new financial all the time, Ah, I'm so good. I just, I'm just being I'm just being me, I have so much energy now. I'm gonna go make dinner for my family. And I'm going to like dance around the kitchen. It's going to be awesome. I hope you all feel the same way. I hope you all feel inspired to make your own libraries and your own lexicons, and then figure out how to change up your messaging in a way that's so empowering. Stephanie thank you so much. And thank you to my audience. My listeners. I'm so grateful for you all if you enjoyed this episode, please like subscribe and share.

This episode is brought to you by MKG Marketing the digital marketing agency that helps complex tech companies like cybersecurity, grow their businesses and fuel their mission through SEO, digital ads, and analytics.

Hosted by Kerry Guard, CEO co-founder MKG Marketing. Music Mix and mastering done by Austin Ellis.

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